More Musings on the Potential for An Anti-Speciesist Carnist to Exist

Question: Can one be a speciesist vegetarian?

Answer: Duh.

Question: Can one be a speciesist vegan?

Answer: Yep.

Question: Can one be an anti-speciesist carnist?



From the Carnism Awareness & Action Network

Carnism is the invisible belief system, or ideology, that conditions people to eat (certain) animals. Carnism is essentially the opposite of vegetarianism or veganism[.]

So carnism is an ideology of the {propriety, acceptability, chillness} of consuming animals (and their products); just as vegetarianism (or veganism) is an ideology of the {impropriety, unacceptability, uncoolness} of consuming animals (and their products).

But we know that not all vegetarians or vegans are anti-speciesist. In fact there is not one veganism or one vegetarianism, but a plethora of veganism and vegetarianisms. Likewise, there is not only one carnism, but a multitude.

And out of this multitude there is the potential for anti-speciesist carnisms, if in fact carnism is only an ideology that allows for the possibility of animal consumption.

[F]or better or worse, we are all participants in the system [carnism]. Our choice is not whether we participate, but how we participate.

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One Response to More Musings on the Potential for An Anti-Speciesist Carnist to Exist

  1. SpeciesistVegan says:

    As you can tell by my name, I am indeed a speciesist and a vegan, but I am really having trouble imagining a “carnist” that is not a speciesist.

    I think that 99% of vegans are actually speciesist (not that you could get more than 10% of them to admit it openly). If you ask them the classic question (burning building, baby and a puppy, only time to save one, which do you save?), all but the most mind-fuc7ed vegans will eventually relent and admit that they’d save the baby. They’ll probably use some tortured logic to explain why their reasoning has nothing to do with species considerations, but still, they come to the same conclusion that 99% of humans recognize as being the right one.

    I don’t see “carnists” being any different, and good on ’em for it. When I encounter people that don’t say that they’d save the baby, I get a chilly, skeeved-out feeling. A person like that is capable of justifying essentially anything they have done or might do. Be wary of people like that. Eewww…..

    So, anyway… give me an example of a self-proclaimed anti-speciesism “carnist.” I don’t think they exist. If you eat hamburgers, you would sure as hell not even hesitate to say that you’d save the baby before the dog, and that makes you speciesist.

    Building a “case” for veganism on the idea of speciesism is possibly the worst thing that could have happened to veganism. Sure, it’s been a convincing argument to millions of vegans around the world for the past 30+ years, but 1) 99.9% of humans don’t buy into the logic of it all (for good reason) and 2) the vegans that I’ve encountered that claim to be totally non-speciesist are creepy and delusional. The appeal of speciesism as a corollary to racism, sexism, choose-your-ism etc. is just too appealing, I guess. It’s a damn shame. There are tons of great reasons to be vegan, but when people encounter the “speciesism is bad, so you MUST go vegan” argument, something in their mind picks up on the moral discrepancy (not that the average meat eater can articulate it very well), and they reject the argument, and reject veganism because of it.

    Humans come first. I know it. Every “carnist” knows it. Most vegans will claim that I’m wrong, but deep inside they know it’s true. And if they hesitate or equivocate on the baby vs. puppy question, they’re not my brethren. I can find more common ground with someone that eats “humane” meat. Toe-the-line vegans are crazy.

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